@dwhaley@hypothes.is would you be interested in collaborating? I am happy to explore this in any other places and formats you consider promising!
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Dan Whaley
Oct 17, 2020
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I’d be honored
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Nil Flancian
Mar 15, 2022
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Thank you my friend! After a long hiatus developing a base (reference) Agora I'm planning on picking this back up in 2022Q2.
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Gyuri Lajos
Mar 16, 2022
Approver
We have a minimal workable prototype in daily use by @gien@stopresetgo.org,we call IndyLab. As you are aware IndyLab nee IndyWiki shares all of the goals of anagora, except it is WebNative, hostless, no server. We whishr to interoperate with anagora. Think of IndyLab as a Sidecar to Anagora offering zero friction provenancial access to content/conversations within Anagora with the ability to take part in the discussion eventually from the comfort of each participant's own tools for thought/wiki. It could also facilitate onboarding into tools/wikis that make the small adjustment needed to call what I just called 'inter web intents' supported by IndyHub powering IndyLab.
For that purpose I would like to propose to turn this document into an IndyLab with initial members/content appearing on this page. That would allow conversations within the Agora community to be continuous without being synchronous yet each participant would own their interactions. It would also provide access to affordances that can only be provided on a server.
Viewed from this perspective IndyLab is positioned as a webnative inter wiki/inter tools for thoughts that are born multiplayer, where the 'Player' the individual's personal digital autonomy and the their ability to be their own(ed) hub and weave their own(ed) personal networks is guaranteed by architecture.
Hypothesis integration is already built into IndyLab, meaning that annotations can act as portal's to conversation much like you do with wiki links in annotations
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Gyuri Lajos
Mar 16, 2022
Approver
Working on that on-boarding inter web intent link
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Nil Flancian
Jul 10, 2022
Approver
Hi! Thank you so much for the proposal!
I like the idea of
1. developing interop indylab-anagora as an exercising of defining and refining Agora Protocol 2. moving to a platform that supports web annotations fully, or improving Docs (maybe through extensions) for it to work well in this ecosystem.
But I also want to be mindful of inclusiveness, in particular as it relates to familiarity with tools like Docs of potential collaborators. Happy to discuss further here, over VC or in the Agora!
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Nil Flancian
Jul 10, 2022
Approver
@gyurio@gmail.com finally getting back to this :) would you like to collaborate on this and base [[indylab]] - [[anagora]] interop on it?
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
Agora is the One, I second that.
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Samuel Klein
Dec 1, 2020
Approver
I like it.
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Nil Flancian
Mar 15, 2022
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Thank you! It's a keeper :)
After a long hiatus I'm planning on picking this back up this upcoming April :)
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Samuel Klein
Mar 15, 2022
Approver
<3 <3 <3 Hurrah
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Nil Flancian
Jul 10, 2022
Approver
Thank you my friends!
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Nil Flancian
Jul 10, 2022
Approver
See comment thread with Gyuri Lajos about moving/improving docs in this respect.
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Ethan Plante
Feb 15, 2021
Approver
I heard a good point on Twitter a bit ago that the reason there are so many of these is that we lack a unifying PKM protocol. It seems like there's a good amount of overlap between what you're describing here, and a more formal protocol for PKM apps
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Jack Park
Nov 9, 2020
Approver
An aside: I've been exploring the notion of typed wikilinks. For instance [[...]] leads to one type of view, {{...}} leads to another. In one of my experiments, LiteNet, [[]] leads to topics, and {{}} will lead to stories (research documents, etc), and all stem from timestamped journal entries.
Correct, but it has not been modified (too busy with other projects) to apply {{}} , and, really, needs a reimplementation for an improved UX; right now, it's the Craig'sList of note takers, but its mission is mostly that of crafting topic maps from journal entries (flows to stocks)
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
Or as Ward Cunningham said: "When you reach the edge of your knowledge, create a new Wiki Page"
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Nil Flancian
Nov 9, 2020
Approver
Nice quote, thank you! Incorporated as a footnote.
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Diego de la Hera
Jan 31, 2021
Approver
Just clarifying for non-Roam-users, blocks in Roam are any single bullet-pointed entries. In Roam they can be referenced to or embedded from elsewhere.
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
as with two-way links transclusion is/has been at the heart of Ted#s Vision of old. today we are creating that Future for the Web that was Ted's Past some half a century ago.
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Anonymous
Nov 19, 2020
Approver
+1
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Diego de la Hera
Jan 31, 2021
Approver
Ted Nelson?
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Nil Flancian
Jul 10, 2022
Approver
This is totally outdated :)
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
TrailMarks has been designed to be multi-player from the ground up as a network of Personal Hubs.
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Nil Flancian
Nov 9, 2020
Approver
Thank you for the information, I will check it out and add it to my under-developed survey of the space (sorry for the delay in getting back to you, by the way!).
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Ethan Plante
Nov 8, 2020
Approver
I believe that Obsidian has this on their roadmap.
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 8, 2020
Approver
We spun out https://twitter.com/TrailHub1 from https://twitter.com/trailmarks to be a Web3Native Kernel so that interoperability across the 1000 networked thought processors could be assured, or even turning even offline Personal Networked Thought processors to be part of an emergent interpersonal social Knowledge Network ready to be federated anywhere
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Ethan Plante
Dec 18, 2020
Approver
Oh, that sounds interesting. What is a Web3Native Kernel?
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Ethan Plante
Dec 18, 2020
Approver
The implications you describe are really compelling. Do you have any working prototypes?
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Gyuri Lajos
Dec 18, 2020
Approver
Looking for pre-alpha testers at this stage. Will post you an invite here if you are interested next Tuesday the earliest.
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Ethan Plante
Dec 18, 2020
Approver
Sure, that would be great.
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
TrailMark as a concept serves that very goal, supported by a co-evolvable kernel for Web 3
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Nil Flancian
Jan 22, 2021
Approver
Hi, Gyuri! My apologies for the inexcusable delay.
That sounds very interesting, which one URL should I link here to detail TrailMark's power and perhaps offer an onboarding strategy?
TrailMarks is about (inter)Personal Interoperability
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
Go WebNative with Fission and people can "host" their things for themselves. https://fission.codes/
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
Need to learn about it Sorry I do not know how to annotate here. Feel free to resolve if this is not helpful Been using Hypothesis for 2 years cannot read without annotating
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Diego de la Hera
Jan 31, 2021
Approver
"cannot read without annotating". I can feel you, definitely.
recently I started exeprimenting 'trailmarks' in my hypothesis annotation https://hypothes.is/users/gyuri This is very much in the spirit of the Agora protocol
e.g.
in a page note I add
- arena : Symbol Flux
As TrailMarks creates a MindGraph from hypothesis annotations and soon from are.na channels these trailmarks can be added automatically
to be interpreted as saying that there is a Symbol Flux Channel in Agora where this page has been saved.
When the person who ceates such a page notes uses TrailMarks they would have the means to interpret that trailmark as they intended/specified/borrowed te means from others
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
exactly and more
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
trailmarks allows for decentralized references across all personal knowledge graphs
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
instead of real time think in terms of eventually resolving as the originator of the resource gets a request and either the request is granted automatically or converted into a "social network" request to "follow" or "request resources" and once granted an appropriate eventually consistent peer to peer channels can be created So the knowledge networks grows into a social interest based decentralized knowledge network
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Gyuri Lajos
Nov 4, 2020
Approver
presume you mean here hosting somewhere in the cloud Heading over to checkout agora on github make sure that TrailMarks is fully interoperable with it
Most web apps are hosted somewhere. There are few exceptions like tiddlywiki. If it was not, it would be mentioned prominently as for TidlyWiki. With IPFS and things like fission.codes WebNative apps will be a new alternative
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phil foto
Jan 20, 2021
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Add tab
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Gemini created these notes. They can contain errors so should be double-checked. How Gemini takes notes
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Document tabs
Agora Protocol (flancia.org/go/agora-protocol)
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